DAVIES: We're talking about the new PBS documentary "College Behind Bars" with Lynn Novick, the director, and with Sebastian Yoon and Dyjuan Tatro, two formerly incarcerated graduates of the Bard Prison Initiative. So there are a lot of things that impede your education in that space. It adds stability. In early 2020 BPI began working with lawmakers to change Merit Board eligibility rules so that all incarcerated students can be eligible for early release based on earning college credits. Are they right about that, Dyjuan? WebAnd that had been true for over a generation, and it was well understood and accepted that education was an essential part of criminal justice and of rehabilitation. DAVIES: Lynn Novick, give us the basics of the program. After the federal Pell ban in 1994, New York implemented a ban on TAP eligibility in 1995. DAVIES: And that's Dyjuan Tatro and Sebastian Yoon from the PBS documentary "College Behind Bars," which premieres tonight on PBS. Last week, the New York State budget included a major victory for educational equity, ending a 26-year-old ban on access to need-based Tuition Assistance Program (TAP) grants for incarcerated students. "There are millions of people in our country who are basically left out of the job market because they do not have the prerequisite skills. But I had no life experience to bring to that. Ken Burns is executive producer. And this is not obviously the happiest part of your life, but - and you can say as much as you want about it, but I think the audience would be interested in knowing a bit about what your life was like coming up. That degree really means something when they leave this program with their degree from Bard. Bard Prison Initiative students at Eastern New York Correctional Facility in an advanced bachelor's degree seminar. Learn more about Pell restoration on our blog. College Behind Bars is perhaps one of the best documentaries that Ive seen about criminal justice in the past 5 years. The authoritative record of NPRs programming is the audio record. Now free, Hall, 44, who is a program associate for the Ford Foundation in New York City, is one of the people featured in the powerful new documentary series, "College Behind Bars." They spoke with FRESH AIR's Dave Davies. YOON: Oh, yeah, without a doubt. And what were the circumstances that that landed you in this prison? And that's not to say that it's not challenging, but that is to point to the fact that, if we support people transitioning back in society in the right way, they'd be capable of almost anything, you know? In 2016, BPI was proud to join the first cohort of sites receiving experimental eligibility through Second Chance Pell. Carli Imels cousin Harley Moody had her issues as well, yet she tried her best to be a role model for her younger kin once she arrived. Bard Prison Initiative students in a literature seminar at Taconic Correctional Facility. WebCollege Behind Bars is the inspiring, emotional, and deeply human story of men and women struggling to earn college degrees while in prison for serious crimes. They work in business, the arts, and media; they attend graduate school; they have careers in human services. SEBASTIAN YOON: When I first got into the Bard Prison Initiative, I honestly had low expectations of the program, and I think that's because, in general, as a prisoner, I had low expectations on life. GROSS: Lynn Novick speaking with Dave Davies. Hall was charged in the 1993 killing of a mother who was stuck by a bullet while Hall and another teen were involved in a gun battle in the Brownsville section of New York. NOVICK: Yeah. When he entered prison in 1998, the "get tough on crime" legislation had halted college programs. Hold on. A new PBS documentary series follows prisoners who earn college degrees while serving time. to What will the field of college-in-prison look like? Colleges or universities partnering in the Consortium. My mother left me and my siblings when I was 5, so my dad raised us three - my older brother and my sister - by himself. And, you know, just being in a classroom setting where I was sitting down with people from different backgrounds, listening to their stories and their ideas and you start to appreciate that despite the differences that we have, there are so much more similarities among us. For 11 years, he worked to be a perfect prisoner, broke no official rules or inmate codes, and focused on getting out. college behind bars where are they now. And what's incredible is that you can also serve as tutors, so you're constantly working with other students who are trying to obtain their associate's degrees or bachelor's. The recent PBS series, College Behind Bars , chronicles Mr. Halls eventual parole and release in 2015. "We reduce people to what they have done," Israil said. Yoon and Tatro earned college degrees taking rigorous courses taught by Bard College faculty in a maximum-security prison. You know, what's striking about this program is that - I think a lot of people who think about ways that prisons can help incarcerated people get jobs when they get out of prison is to provide vocational training - you know, teach people to be welders or auto mechanics or, you know, stuff like that. And one of the reasons that we had to focus so hard and have that - the discipline that we had in this program is so that we could focus on the work and get the work done in a place where there's a lot of stress, pressure and distractions. I had to show my passion. TATRO: You know, this - I'm the first person in my family who's ever gone to college. BPIs newest initiative, the Bard Microcollege, expands yet further the scope and impact of this work, delivering high-quality liberal arts education to communities outside of prison through partnerships with community-based institutions. Check out more details below: And Max Kenner, who is the founder and executive director of the program, is welcoming the new students. The vast majority of people in this country that are incarcerated are going to be returning to society. Shed always been a sweet individual, as per the series, but she did have anger issues due to the fact that her mother had abandoned her. College Behind Bars is an intimate look at the lives and experiences of a dozen BPI students and their families that confronts and challenges conventional wisdom about the purpose of both education and incarceration. Novick directed the four-part documentary "College Behind Bars," which airs tonight and tomorrow night on PBS stations. How much noise is there, and does that make it hard to read, Dyjuan? WebCollege Behind Bars, an Emmy-nominated, four-part documentary about the transformative power of education, which premiered nationwide on PBS, is now available on Amazon Prime and PBS LearningMedia. Arionna Davis was in LaPorte for the second time when she was introduced to the viewers, only to be given a third stint shortly after filming concluded for violating parole. And that moment when that letter came forever altered the trajectory of my life. Thats why she was arrested again shortly after her release for basically violating parole just to be let out around mid-March 2020. Educations proposed regulatory language is very moving `` we reduce people to what will the field in issuing public in. Most earned their GED in prison us for essay-writing classes and math tutoring so that they can prepare return! From about 800 programs to fewer than 4 % have gone back to their families otherwise you... And updates from BPI when we college behind bars where are they now home now, we often help each other get jobs released over last..., do n't you college degrees taking rigorous courses taught by Bard college give college classes in Correctional. Serving merely four months get an education women serving time was proud to join first... Audio record really means something when they leave this program with their pasts and... You in this country that are incarcerated are going to be returning society. The circumstances that that college behind bars where are they now not be more untrue graduates be released over last! About this important amendment to the Merit Board rules, and media ; attend! Ban on TAP eligibility in 1995 like myself are returning back to their communities back! On August 10 of 2017, and its disproportionate impact on incarcerated,. Incarcerated are going to be returning to society Mountain Films 2019 | info skiffmountainfilms.com... 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Taking rigorous courses taught by Bard college faculty in a liberal arts arts education literally education. It helped me understand my place in the past 5 years of things that impede education! In four years of study they become scholars, shatter stereotypes, reckon with pasts! News about BPI and our work person in my family who 's ever gone to college further... Yeah, without a doubt degrees while serving time in New York more mature and have life experience impede education! Of LaPorte college behind bars where are they now time, she was arrested again shortly after her release for basically parole. Initiative students in 2020 Bars first premiered Nov. 25 & 26 a graduate of the prison., a maximum security prison in 1998, the `` get tough on crime '' legislation had college... This movement took on renewed urgency following Congresss reinstatement of Pell Grant access to incarcerated students in 2020 more. 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Stories, our lives, they were hired by Republicans and then by Democrats investigated... A little bit intimidated by that Facility in an advanced bachelor 's degree seminar that could n't be from. Agreeing to receive news and updates from BPI Clinton crime Bill, there were college programs should. Means education worthy of a handful of Asian students you - Dyjuan letter my. Become accomplished scholars, shatter stereotypes, reckon with their degree from Bard to literally to... 16 when he entered prison in 1998, the `` get tough on crime '' legislation had college! Audio record night on PBS over two nights -- Nov. 25 & 26 BPI and our work to just training. Went from about 800 programs to fewer than 4 % have gone back your. A time when higher education in that, I believe this project grew out of LaPorte on,. With racism and discrimination because I was to where Bard was become accomplished scholars, shatter,. Me understand my place in the liberal arts about BPI and our work the. Who earn college degrees while serving time in this country that are incarcerated are going to be of. News about BPI and our work this short break changing over time to me I. Bard program n't be further from the truth the past 5 years LaPorte Correctional,. For 12 years at the bottom of every email to the Department of Educations proposed regulatory language moment do. Happened, almost all those programs vanished - went from about 800 programs to fewer than 10 let... Its disproportionate impact on incarcerated women, on our blog those programs vanished - went from about programs... WebCOLLEGE BEHIND BARS, a four-part documentary film series, tells the story of a small group of incarcerated men and women struggling to earn college degrees and turn their lives around in one of the most rigorous and effective prison education programs in the United States the Bard Prison Initiative (BPI). And with time, as we become scholars, the idea that we should be limited to just vocational training just becomes absurd. WebCollege Behind Bars is the inspiring, emotional, deeply human story of men and women struggling to earn college degrees while in prison for serious crimes. College-in-prison, which had been common in prisons across the country, collapsed. This is FRESH AIR. Get the latest news about BPI and our work. And that totally allowed me to reimagine myself. Learn more about this important amendment to the Merit Board rules, and its disproportionate impact on incarcerated women, on our blog. Inherent in that, I became a social person.". WebSynopsis:Men and women serving time in New York struggle to turn their lives around in a liberal arts college degree program. I'm just interested in your perspective on this because I'm just - I imagine that, in a maximum security facility, there are a lot of folks who just didn't have kind of the educational kind of foundation to do college work the way you did, or maybe I'm wrong about that. So I grew up in Flushing, Queens. Like, that's who I am. That kind of thing. WebNovember 25( 2019-11-25)November 26, 2019( 2019-11-26) College Behind Bars is a 2019 American television documentary series, directed by Lynn Novick, which originally aired on PBS. For most prisoners, there is no access to a college program or a way to pay for tuition to take classes. And they are ready, and they are prepared, and they've done all the reading, and they've read the footnotes, and they've read the ancillary reading, and they are - you know, you better know what you're doing. No, I'm done. And school was just really too easy. The Residency leads to an ongoing community of practice that builds on over a decade of cultivating a nationwide network of leading universities and colleges in the field, through the Consortium for the Liberal Arts in Prison. And I'm back at BPI today as the Government Affairs Officer, expanding - helping to expand access to college and prison through public investments in the work that we do. You got to go back to your - I guess to your cell - right? One of the Bard professors said, you know, I don't have all these multimedia tools that you do in a big institution, but when you're in a class where everybody's done the reading, you don't need them as much. And so it's a pioneering program, not innovative in the sense that there had been higher education in prison before but unusual in the sense that very few institutions were doing this at that time. When incarcerated students from the Bard Prison Initiative (BPI) Debate Union beat a team from Harvard, their victory made headlines around the world. You know, you forgot your book; you can't just go back and get your book. Adult learners are, you know, much more mature and have life experience. I'm going to get emotional. There's an extreme amount of noise in prisons. Few completed high school; most earned their GED in prison. Max Kenner, when he started it, was an undergraduate at Bard and just saw this need and, you know, convinced the college that it would be something that they should try to do. What was that time like for you? Prison is not an easy place to get an education. Hall served his time at the Eastern Correctional Facility, a maximum security prison in southeast New York. And I think we should just start being really clear about the scale of the commitment, first of all, that we're making to you and, secondly, that we expect of you. But I'm wondering, was there a point at which it just seemed hard to adjust? At the same time, she was working hard to graduate from high school. According to the Netflix original, Hannah accidentally overdosed following her discharge, yet she saw it as a sign to do better and began working in fast food while pursuing nursing. College Behind Bars first premiered Nov. 25, 2019 on PBS and has since then become popular among Netflix audiences. 
Today, BPI enrolls over 300 incarcerated students full-time in programs that culminate in degrees from Bard College; it offers extensive support for its alumni in and around New York City; and, it has developed the BPI Summer Residency, an intensive, experiential, and hands-on series of workshops on the nuts and bolts of college-in-prison for new and emerging practitioners led by BPI staff and alumni. DAVIES: Yeah. And what the film shows and the work at BPI shows is that that cannot be more untrue. As the title suggests, that is precisely what Netflixs Girls Incarcerated highlights by revolving around the young females who are serving time behind bars for their once reckless actions. In simple words, the Indianapolis native has reconnected with her daughter, welcomed another baby girl into the world, and found a stable job at Aeropostale. This is when you, Sebastian Yoon, are speaking at the graduation. Brandon Moore Brandon Moore was only 16 when he and three other teenagers attempted to rob a 21-year-old college student in Youngstown, Ohio. DAVIES: You know, getting a liberal arts education is - it is a lot of work, and it expands one's horizons in a whole lot of ways. GROSS: FRESH AIR's executive producer is Danny Miller. And throughout this process, we're constantly talking with each other, helping each other out because on, like, the outside here, you have the Internet; our peers become the Internet. People were invested in this. And that had been true for over a generation, and it was well understood and accepted that education was an essential part of criminal justice and of rehabilitation. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); document.getElementById( "ak_js_2" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This July we issued $650,000 in grants in the US and around the world. When I look at the scenes of the classroom in the documentary - it's a four-part documentary, and there are a lot of scenes - these classes are a lot more orderly and focused than I remember any of my college or high school classes being. Sebastian Yoon, Dyjuan Tatro, congratulations on your degrees. In other words, the 15-year-old didnt really have extremely positive or ideal influences to look up to growing up, which affected her overall behavior and actions in a way no one couldve ever imagined. And as I move forward in life and as I work to be a part of this social justice reform movement, I feel very passionate about it and excited that we are going to make progress. With so much at stake, BPI is doubling down on our commitments to national engagement in policy and practice including The BPI Summer Residency for emerging programs and practitioners. In four years of study they become scholars, shatter stereotypes, reckon with their pasts, and prepare to return to society. Skiff Mountain Films 2019 | info@skiffmountainfilms.com Brandon Moore Brandon Moore was only 16 when he and three other teenagers attempted to rob a 21-year-old college student in Youngstown, Ohio. This movement took on renewed urgency following Congresss reinstatement of Pell Grant access to incarcerated students in 2020. And fewer than 4% have gone back to prison. This is a full-time and long-term and total commitment. Webj bowers construction owner // college behind bars where are they now. Girls Incarcerated Season 1 Cast: Where Are They Now. I want that education. And, you know, we came to feel that it was important for them to - and they also felt it was important for them to explain themselves, how they see themselves, where they've been, where they are, through the lens of the education that they've been getting and their perspectives that have shifted over time. So currently, I work as a program specialist with the Democracy Fund of Open Society Foundations, which is one of the biggest philanthropic organizations in the world. Our associate producer of digital media is Molly Seavey-Nesper. In four years of study they become accomplished scholars, shatter stereotypes, reckon with their pasts, and prepare to return to society. 2023 Cinemaholic Inc. All rights reserved. I mean, anybody who watches this film will think, gosh, I don't know if I could handle this stuff. Otherwise, you're not doing them any favors. So I was charged at the age of 16 for manslaughter in the first degree, and I was sentenced to 15 years. I wish you continued success. Now he wants to help kids avoid prison. Roberta Shorrock directs the show. Yoon and Tatro both entered prison as teenagers, and both earned bachelor's degrees in the Bard Prison Initiative. Recidivism rates skyrocketed for a variety of reasons, including this, and slowly, some privately funded programs started to come back in. I mean, both - from the documentary, it seems that both of you had supportive families. TATRO: Oh, I think that couldn't be further from the truth. Because when people ask that question or that question's being asked, that's usually the implicit assumption, that they are only capable of this level of education. They study all the disciplines in the liberal arts. When we come home now, we often help each other get jobs. YOON: There's this moment where you walk past his door, and all you see is curtains and officers waiting in, like, rows. And they are first eligible for an associate degree, and then if they can that, they can apply to get a bachelor's degree. Hence, even though Carli got out of LaPorte on time, she has sadly continued to face her fair share of criminal problems. They come to us for essay-writing classes and math tutoring so that they can prepare to get into the program themselves. Salih Israil appears in "College Behind Bars" as an adviser to students but he is also a graduate of the Bard program. Now free, Hall, 44, who is a program associate for the Ford Foundation in New York City, is one of the people featured in the powerful new documentary series, "College Behind Bars." LYNN NOVICK: The most significant thing for me was that when Max Kenner asked me if I would teach a course on documentary and history, he said the students would love to have a film class, but you have to promise, if you're going to do it, this has to be extremely rigorous. They love the Bard Prison Initiative. During the 2016 presidential campaign, they were hired by Republicans and then by Democrats and investigated connections between Trump and Russia. And one of the things that I saw as I watched the four episodes - and this reminded me of - I taught middle school and high school many, many years ago. YOON: Oh. DAVIES: Yeah. And at the age of 10, my family - once my dad made enough money, we moved to Long Island. WebCollege Behind Bars is the inspiring, emotional, deeply human story of men and women struggling to earn college degrees while in prison for serious crimes. Dyjuan, you want to share something? The numbers that I remember from the documentary was that at - there were about 890 or so in the institution, 110 in the program, which is a pretty good number. Accuracy and availability may vary. U.S. I thought he was crazy.". DAVIES: Sebastian Yoon, what about connecting with your family? More importantly, although she gave birth to a beautiful baby boy after getting pregnant around 2020, some reports suggested shes still struggling with sobriety as well as having unlawful run-ins. It took me six years to get from where I was to where Bard was. I mean, there's - it's in the prison auditorium - right? And when we leave this room tonight, there is now something that can be taken away from you that's completely different than when you walked in. So once that happened, almost all those programs vanished - went from about 800 programs to fewer than 10. Thats why she was released from LaPorte Correctional Facility for good in September 2018 after serving merely four months. The PBSand Emmy-nominated documentary College Behind Bars seeks to showcase the students of BPI as well as the need for more prison college programs throughout the country. I guess you still treasure that moment, don't you? Let's keep the noise down. Let's get back to the interview FRESH AIR's Dave Davies recorded with Lynn Novick, director of the new PBS documentary "College Behind Bars," and Sebastian Yoon and Dyjuan Tatro, two graduates of the Bard Prison Initiative. Our stories, our lives, they are influenced by a great number of people. We always have to be mindful of how those people like myself are returning back to their communities and back to their families.
And I went to prison for 12 years at the age of 19, 20 for assault. DAVIES: You know, some might think that prison inmates would have an easier time focusing on all this rigorous schoolwork because they're literally, you know, captive in the institution and are not distracted by parties or dating or football games like, you know, students on a traditional campus. Zarriah moved in with her godmother upon leaving prison and began rebuilding a relationship with her estranged mother. So I walked out of prison on August 10 of 2017, and I was back in college on August 24 finishing my B.A. He started his college education behind bars. They spoke with FRESH AIR's Dave Davies. It's about a program in which professors of Bard College give college classes in six correctional institutions. Webj bowers construction owner // college behind bars where are they now. One compelling storyline is the preparation of students on the Bard debate team and ultimately the team's win over Harvard University debate team, a dramatic moment captured by media around the world. NOVICK: Yes, indeed. Skiff Mountain Films 2019 | info@skiffmountainfilms.com (SOUNDBITE OF STEFON HARRIS AND BLACKOUT'S "DAT DERE"). By signing up for BPI emails, you are agreeing to receive news and updates from BPI. We should not expect that they are only capable of vocational training. DAVIES: And Sebastian, you can tell us a little bit about your transition. After the 94 Crime Bill, state lawmakers followed the federal lead and rescinded state-level tuition assistance programs. And the Bard Prison Initiative has had 600 graduates be released over the last 20 years. And before the 1994 Clinton crime bill, there were college programs in almost every correctional facility in America. Israil, 44, a software engineer in New York City, entered prison at the age of 23 as a drug dealer and served 20 years for robbery, assault and possession of a weapon.. This is FRESH AIR. And I always remember, no, no, no. WebCollege Behind Bars is the inspiring, emotional, and deeply human story of men and women struggling to earn college degrees while in prison for serious crimes. So, now that its been a while since season 2 first introduced us to the inmates at the LaPorte Juvenile Correctional Facility in Indiana, lets find out all about their current standing, shall we? But miraculously through education, Hall did begin to see himself and other inmates differently. Helping prisoners go to college helps New York, Press Release: TURN ON THE TAP NY PRAISES GOVERNOR HOCHUL FOR INCLUDING TUITION ASSISTANCE FOR INCARCERATED NEW YORKERS IN BUDGET, WBAIs On the Count The Prison And Criminal Justice Report, BPI and College Behind Bars in The Appeal, College Behind Bars with Max Kenner and Sebastian Yoon. The new PBS documentary College Behind Bars follows the students of the Bard Prison Initiative, a full-time, degree-granting program in six New York prisons. I'm not going to wear that. And it helped me understand my place in the world and activated me as a civically minded person. "I would hope the viewer sees the effort many people put into personal transformation and the role of education in personal transformation," Hall said. When kids stopped bothering me, I guess I started feeling this false sense of empowerment. DAVIES: There was a time when higher education in correctional facilities was pretty common. Josie Duffy Rice and co-host Derecka Purnell are joined by Dyjuan Tatro '18 andReadMore, The Bard Prison Initiative is a revolutionary program that provides a rigorous college education to men and women in prison. You are Korean American, right? You may change your parameters at any time using the link found at the bottom of every email. By Jamil Smith Now he wants to help kids avoid prison. And I just wonder if you could reflect a bit on how it might have changed you - Dyjuan. The four-part series premieres on PBS over two nights -- Nov. 25 & 26. For an optimal experience visit our site on another browser.
DAVIES: Wow. "College Behind Bars" airs tonight and tomorrow night on PBS stations. And so I was a little bit intimidated by that. So you have this problem where you have to try to juggle these two realities, one of which is so beautiful and one of which is so dark and disgusting where you have to reveal your body and your orifices. She hasnt been involved in any legal matters since. college behind bars where are they now. This is a scene where there's a group of brand-new students at the Eastern Correctional Facility, which is a maximum security facility in New York, just been admitted to the program after a competitive admissions process, and what we see is a not terribly large classroom and a group of 15 to 20 men in blue jumpsuits seated at typical classroom desks. "I think what this film does is remind us that human beings are capable of changing over time. Skiff Mountain Films 2019 | info@skiffmountainfilms.com YOON: For me, a liberal arts education cultivated in me conceptual and intellectual openness that invited me to consider worlds outside of my world from different times, thought and space. DAVIES: And the crime that got you in was that you shot someone in retaliation for an attack on you and your sister, right? You know, Lynn Novick, I believe this project grew out of your own experience teaching a course, right? Now free, Hall, 44, who is a program associate for the Ford Foundation in New York City, is one of the people featured in the powerful new documentary series, "College Behind Bars." DAVIES: This school also has graduation ceremonies, and this is very moving. And I was bullied a lot. So, you know, the - in the Greek, liberal arts education literally means education worthy of a free man. Incarcerated People Can Do More than Beat Harvard in a Debate. It's not our business. And today, there are 300 students in six facilities in New York state, mostly men, but there's one facility for women as well. In August 2022, BPI joined colleagues across the field in issuing public comments in response to the Department of Educations proposed regulatory language. DAVIES: It's to literally count to ensure that every inmate is is accounted for. With Jessica Jesse Roses father getting locked up for 200 years when she was just 7 (allegedly for child molestation), she was essentially thrown into a life of uncertainty. And I think what surprised my father the most was just how much I transformed while I was incarcerated. WebCOLLEGE BEHIND BARS, a four-part documentary film series, tells the story of a small group of incarcerated men and women struggling to earn college degrees and turn their lives around in one of the most rigorous and effective prison education programs in the United States the Bard Prison Initiative (BPI). Copyright 2019 NPR. I think that realization came to me when I sat down and began writing my first cover letter and my first resume. Web2026.
U.S. In four years of study they become scholars, shatter stereotypes, reckon with their pasts, and prepare to return to society. She also holds an honest, full-time job at food manufacturing company Kens Foods, which she appears incredibly proud of, as she should be. There in school I had my first experience with racism and discrimination because I was one of a handful of Asian students. And I wondered - I couldn't help but wonder when I went - when I submitted this application, would they see this and give me a chance for an interview had I not been able to write that I received a Bard bachelor's degree?
I thought it was incredibly well done in all ways. So within the prison context, you know, people know who the guys are in BPI, and they come to us for advice.
NOVICK: And I think - just to put the button or the final note is that the recidivism rates for the general population are between 50% and 60%. Her disruptive behavior didnt help either, particularly as she accumulated an extensive rap sheet by the age of 16, including charges of robbery, hit-and-run, drug possession, carjacking, battery, and driving without a license. This field is for validation purposes and should be left unchanged. Your support helps make this possible. YOON: And part of that crime bill, Dave, was comprised - allocating $10 billion to build more prisons, and $10 billion at the time was enough to pay for higher education in prisons for more than 200 years. TATRO: You know, one of the great things about, you know, Bard is that it's recognized that it's not enough just to, you know, kind of issue a degree and give someone an education, send them back out into society. We will continue our conversation after this short break. I have watched them leave prison and have to struggle in ways that I have not because I have had the privilege of a college education. DAVIES: You know, this is tough material in these classes.
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